Circle Jerks - Let's Talk About It
THIS IS NOT FINANCIAL ADVICE; THIS IS MY JOURNEY. YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR YOUR MONEY.
Watch at 1.5x speed for better viewing pleasure!
Cliff Notes:
Things I look to downvote: Spam/plagiarism, vote buyers who don’t burn steem to negate the ROI.
Vote-buying = vote manipulation = selfish and won't fly in the wild, we have "teeth" now.
we identify issues as a community and come together to fix.
"circle jerks" are different. should be renamed to "reward disagreement"
retaliating is not the answer but is the default for most.
tokens can be sold, there can be whales. no whales no liquidity.
if the token has influence whales will have more influence.
if you want a socialist platform, where you penalize whales, you will have a coin with zero liquidity.
I follow the @ocdb downvote trail. I trust them to make the best decisions for the Steem.
▶️ 3Speak
@tipu curate 2
Upvoted 👌 (Mana: 12/18)
"I'm here for the long term" this statement summarises my feelings about Steem.
decentralization also means we can all make our own standards. Everyone is basically their own boss.
Circle jerking has been on my mind for a while but you know, I'm good with it and the whole essence of steem is having the power to create quality.
You talk about reward disagreement but we also need to create something like a Union to prevent the potential of abuse. I get scared of downvoting because of retaliation.
I suppose the next thing to fix would be how to reward quality posts...
That is fixed, organic votes are dominate now. I simply was asked about circle jerks and I feel if people disagree with the amount of rewards a post makes, they have every right, based on their stake, to downvote.
I think the better question would be to find a better solution to heal blind retaliatory downvotes vs honest reward disagreement. This is something, like with paid votes, we can come together as a community to solve.
I agree, but for me right now it is more about being seen and getting something to downvote. No one can say that I'm making far too much for doing too little....
I start to see the problematic of voteselling and liking the idea of the downvotes. Never used them yet, but the chance of my first downvote rising gets higher everyday. Never tought that likes and upvotes became so important in general.
First players hit 50% ROI, after 15 days, woop woop
You're definitely correct, at the end of the day, it boils down to healthy environment, it's no compulsory that everybody goes kumbaya and cheers and all, when we have disagreements it creates a certain kind of equilibrium that makes for check and Balance in the Steem Community. Obviously relationship are essential and that's why it's important that we maintain them as much as there are a a lot of prejudice about steem, we believe it'll grow with time and the relationships we build now is what'll will determine the behaviors that will be carried for a lasting period and that's why it's good to maintain a good reputation here on steem. Thanks a million Dan, this is wonderful.
Well said.
Let's take your example of two individuals buying stake and only upvoting each other. I think the problem in that case is that all they would be adding to this platform is an initial investment. They wouldn't be adding any network value, as they're only interacting with each other. I think it goes without saying that anyone doing that would be on constant power down/sell cycle, and this is what we see with a lot of circle jerks. By that I mean the obvious groups of people who are literally only swapping votes and the odd comment with each other, while ignoring the wider community. This is the thing that drives many many new users away. It's the thing I spotted here 2 years ago when I first started and I nearly left. I remember it well actually, I stopped posting for about 10 days and then woke up one day and thought, let's have another crack at working out if there is any way to actually get noticed organically in this place. Luckily curie voted the next post i made lol. My stubborn nature paid off 😂
This is what I see as the major problem with the whole issue of vote swapping (circle jerks), it's not that I can't recognise that they've invested money and now they want ROI. But I do have a problem with how off putting observing those closed loops is to intelligent potential new steemians. This was even worse when I joined as there were people getting upvoted to the tune of 1k in $ value for absolute dog shit posts... and honestly, there is still a core of that old school left here, although there are less these days. The person I'm thinking about as I write this is now averaging $4 - $5 per post, rather than $400+. This is proof that things are changing for the better as their posts certainly haven't improved in quality, but at least the rewards are closer to a qualitive standard. But to be honest, it's probably mainly because they sold a large portion of their stake along with the rest of their circle of 'friends'.
So what's my point? Ha ha, well simply that I think it can't go unchecked because that has, and will continue to, drive decent content creators away. The type of people who would become active, valuable contributers to the community and the network. To attract big investment and big advertising budgets to steem we need a strong network.
I can tell that you're of the same mind when it comes to the obvious over rewarded vote traders from what you've said in this video. Tbh, I'm just thinking outloud here. It's certainly not a simple Q + A subject 🙂
P.s. I'm following the OCD downvote trial now and have experienced retaliatory votes. But you know what, it was worth it. I checked on all of the posts OCD was downvoting in the first 3 days after I joined the trial and all of them were legit downvoting bidbot abuse.
I don't like the term circle jerks. Either the content is obviously over rewarded, or it's not. I would upvote a post I liked, regardless of who voted before it. Painting circle jerks makes it too narrow IMO and can lead to unwarranted downvotes.
Now, with obv vote swapping, and that content strangling others shot are being organically trending, can be countered with downvotes. That is simple reward disagreement, you think the post is overvalued, regardless if satan or Santa Claus voted them.
I get that you don't like the term circle jerk. Fair enough, I only used it for reference.
At the end of the day you're right about it essentially being a disagreement over reward value... and everyone has a choice to use their downvotes to try and combat what they see as wrong. That really is one of the successes of the EIP that the consensus so far seems to be one of sensible measures to incentivise proof of brain.
My main concern is the effect on new users watching very obvious vote trading circles. And I think it's a legitimate concern - as long as steem is considered a content creators platform - for the long term success of steem! The community needs to grow with a healthy dynamic... but at this point it just needs to grow to build the value of the network and the market cap!
I've personally seen the amount of people who've left steem because of either bidbots or vote swapping when curating for curie. Because I used to watch promising new content creators for potential submissions, I saw many who wrote final posts quiting within weeks of joining. In most cases they cited the reasons I mentioned.
I agree on the effects to outside viewers. I don't agree with downvoting people based on who voted on them. I don't see "vote traders" making great content, because if they did, they wouldn't need to trade votes. So, with vote trading comes greed, and with greed comes downvotes.
The system is self correcting in the end if people use the tools available to them.
One cocern is fear of honest voting due to retailiation. This is a subject I am brain storming to come up with possible solutions. I think without fear of realtionation, we would see a equalibriem on what content is worth what and get a more fair free market assement on what each post is worth.
Yeah, I agree with this completely. I'm not sure if I communicated that well in my comment.
Interesting. I'll think on this one myself as well, although I'm not sure if I'll come up with anything tbh, it's a difficult conundrum. It's definitely a legitimate fear for most users... simply because of stake and people not wanting to have their accounts destroyed. This is just a risk you take, but the fear is very real for lower stakeholders. I literally didn't downvote at all until about a month ago, and I've never been fearful about expressing my opinions about some of these issues in comments on posts where many people would have seen them. It's an odd psychological effect that the fear of hitting that downvote button sticks.
Anyway, interesting conversation... it has left me thinking.
You forgot about one type of the reward pool abuse where term #circlejerk fits perfectly. Delegate and get upvote scheme. It works like this:
Maybe I'm wrong but in my opinion this is abuse and I call it circle jerk
Yeah, I understand what you're saying about the 'delegate for a vote' groups, but I think it's hard when someone is struggling to earn on steem after a long time, and huge amounts of content produced, not to feel they deserve some basic level of income.
But the biggest problem with these groups is they rarely have any quality control, and it's for that reason I think they could be considered reward pool abuse. If someone is creating decent content (I see plenty of minnows like that who've been on steem for a while), and not earning consistent rewards, then they're going to seek out a way to try and find some consistent reward for their content... but those delegate for a vote schemes do tend to encourage daily post farming as they're usually one vote/day.
It's an interesting distinction, and I guess a question of where you draw the line.
I don't see a big difference between trading and buying votes.
A good post by a minnow who bought a vote may also not be overrewarded, there are a few examples of not too shabby, not too good, creators who are upset now because their content never had a chance to get up without bought votes, and now they are downvoted.
Both are selfish transactions which only benefit those who are involved in the deal, and the end result of both is off-putting for new users who see they can never reach something without participating in some kind of deal.
That everyone uses the derogatory term circle jerk is an unfortunate development, the whitepaper speaks much more clearly of "colluding groups".
If it is literally voting trading, in the sense of an agreement (which, to complicate things a bit, could be implicit) to exchange votes, and not just friends voting for each other a lot, then it is identical to vote buying/selling.
If A buys from B and B buys from A, no payment needs to change hands but this is either a vote trade or two vote buys. Exactly the same.
You summarised the problem well here pharesim. And I see the issue as being where we draw the line?
For example, I support quite a well known funny Scottish writer on steem... the reason being I'm primarily a creative writer myself, both on and outside of steem. I now earn a large part of my income from writing (not on steem lol), and I appreciate good writing when I see it. I read most of his posts, and comment on one or two a week. He also comments on some of mine. We both vote each others posts, but there has been no collusion, i.e. I haven't spoken to him saying 'hey lets vote each other'. It has happened organically. I'm very confident this isn't vote swapping because it's based on a mutual appreciation for each others writing. Also, at the end of the day I've been on here for 2 and a bit years putting up only high quality written posts, and I deserve to grow. But you're right in what you say here:
And it might seem slightly disparaging to a new user looking at my posts sometimes. However, if they asked me how i built up my account on steem I'd always answer them; discord networking, getting involved in projects, years of consistent quality content creation, making friends by reading/commenting others work and generally a lot of hard work. Also, I always go look at anyone's blog who has commented on my posts, not everyone does that on steem which has pissed me off in the past and made me teeter on the edge of quiting myself many times.
I think with the 'vote colluding groups' it's very obviously a different dynamic. They rarely vote outside of their circle and often won't even respond to comments unless it's from someone at the same SP level as them. It's this type of elitism which drives people away every day, and I'm sorry to say that some of the higher SP holders are guilty of this.
So what is my point? I think it's important to consider many factors and look at a steemians conduct when considering this issue. Time spent on platform, how they've interacted with others, what they produce (their content), projects they've been involved with etc. It's important to look at it on a case by case basis rather than just going on a witch hunt and arbitrarily downvoting anyone who uses an automated voting service. Otherwise it's basically going to end up as a bunch of high SP individuals and curation services driving away established steemians. This is why it's important to look at it case by case, so that those who've actually added value to this place don't get targeted. At the end of the day, not everyone can put the monumental amounts of time in on steem as others, and that could be why they do a certain amount of automated voting.
I've seen what's going on at the moment with a group of 'vote swapping' people and I agree that they're a pretty cut and dry group who've been leaching this place for years. One of them shouts loudly about how great their content is (it's not, I've read it) and how they've helped many people on steem in their discord. But it's easy to see that all they've helped people to do is learn how to network with each other. They still judge everyone based on SP, and this is the defining factor, they've rarely voted anyone with lower sp than them. This is the problem, these types of people who see this as acceptable, and to be honest, they're shooting themselves (and all of us) in the foot long term because steem's only proven mechanism for price increase is to increase the size of the network (speculation)... and their behaviour is actively decreasing the size of the network.
This is why curation groups like yours are essential. I've been a curie curator for years now and I see this as my way, being relatively low SP holder, to give new users a leg up. I always leave a comment on the posts I curate for curie, and not one saying I'm a curie curator either, just a decent encouraging comment about their post. Curie is literally the reason why I stayed on steem and kept creating long form content as my 5th post got hit with a curie vote, so I feel strongly about them from a personal level.
I'm hopeful for Newsteem tbh. I think it's changed behaviours in regards to the bidbots much quicker than I could have ever imagined. But there's still a lot needs doing, and I hope it can be timed to coincide with the next (if it ever happens 😆) alt bull run, so that we can attract, and retain, even more new steemians. I remember how exciting this place was in 2017, I'd love to see that again!
Nothing to add, I fully agree.
It is getting interesting with the retaliation at the moment and it seems that there is a little bit of "wagon circling" as those who want to keep trading votes band tighter together to punish those who disagree with the rewards. Might get a little lively, but a bit of drama can be valuable.
Decentralization comes with "gangs" and "tribes" and the friction can sometimes be a good thing if all sides can learn and grow. Everyone agreeing all the time can be bad, and everyone disagreeing all the time can be good. Just what we do as a community, consensus of stake will pave the path forward.
Looking forward to some kind of alignment toward growth of the entire ecosystem in multiple ways and perspectives through apps, SMTs and communities. People can compete and argue still, but do it in a way that generates value, rather than for the sake of pure pettiness.
SMTs will fix a lot of this TBH. I forgot to mention that in this video. I actually recorded this twice, as the first one didn't record lol. SMTs will make it so that if a whale wants to buy up a bunch of X SMT, then all the hodlers make money in the process. Also, communities will have much more control.
However, we still need to keep standard with Steem, as it is the most liquid token with PoB, therefore the most desired to abuse.
Definitely.
null
I couldn’t of said it better myself 💪🏼🙌🏼💯
Posted using Partiko iOS
Sure, i get where youre coming from and what this is related to but go read this if you want more clarification as to whats going on in the case people have mentioned to you.
https://steempeak.com/abuse/@lordbutterfly/time-to-deal-with-the-circlejerks-the-slowwalker-broncnutz-dobartim-czechglobalhost-jerkathon
Its not them upvoting friends... its them trading votes. Huge difference.. But even if you put all that aside and say:
The fact still remains that they ADMIT to circle jerking and trading votes. They admit to not voting honestly or even caring about the other persons content. They vote to trade votes. To get voted back..
Even if you dismiss any and all arguments for "circle jerking" them admitting to it should be enough....
That is the beautfy of decentralaztion, if you disagree with what they are doing you can downvote them. I did not name any names in my video, I speak with my actions. But, if it is obvious vote trading that is abusive to Steem, then that is something to look closely at.
I still believe it comes down to the value of said content. If someone makes a post that would normally make 100$ if they didnt "trade votes" but only gets 20$, and then gets lowered to 10$ because of downvotes due to vote trading, that becomes a very odd system IMO.
I don't see "vote traders" making great content, because if they did, they wouldn't need to trade votes. So, with vote trading comes greed, and with greed comes downvotes. So, it becomes reward farming at that point, because they are just voting crap.
Sure, but we both follow hot topics on Steem so im pretty sure what this is about. lol
Vote traders indeed arent great content creators. If im honest theres barely a dozen really good content creators on the whole platform, but thats not here nor there.
What the guys that people are going after now are doing is as close to spam you can get without having your content being called spam.
Still... Im saying, disregard all that which can be seen as subjective and ask them. I did ask them and i provided screenshots in the post i linked. They admit that they trade votes and vote dishonestly.
If theyre admitting to it, how is that any different then what bots have been doing? How is that any different from excessive self voting?
Its not.
I agree if people are openly vote trading blindly, that is not good for steem or proof of brain. People that do such behavior will be under a lot of scrutiny , especially since bid bot abuse has all be died out.
--->@acidyo
Check out what hes dealing with. He could use some help.
The point of getting rid of vote selling wasnt in hurting the stake holders behind it but rather get them to change their ways and still profit from Steem.
That has been achieved.
Same goes for the slowwalker/broncnutz/dobartim circlejerk.
I dont want those guys to leave, i want them to profit, but profit in the way that isnt destructive to everyone else (and even to themselves in the long run).
For those that hate whales and think they are bad for steem, i disagree with that greatly.
I gave the analogy of the Duke on Milano without whom there would be no "Last Supper" by Da Vinci, which is one of the most famous pieces of art in human history.
We need whales, we need patrons, they will be the ones that will at a point in future help create "That great piece of art." That great creator. Id give you the example i dmed you about a few months ago if you remember. Where in the end a whale did patron the creation of a great piece of content imo.
You know this, i see what you do with 3speak.
What we do not need is whales farming steem and voting dishonestly.
People pay attention to how people vote and who's voting, not just the amount. That's just human nature. I could stick two comparable posts side-by-side with the same rewards, and come to entirely different conclusions about them based upon the voting that took place.
I agree with almost everything you said man. Still remember when Steem was sitting at 4$+ and people were making ridiculous amounts of money from posts and the voters didn't even possess 1/2 of the SP they do now...
I mean...thousands of dollars per post...I was a newcomer then and it seemed unreal, and nobody was giving a shit. Kinda funny considering that we now -mostly due to the bear market- downvote posts from 20$ to 10 or from 10 to 5$...
Don't get me wrong some of them fully deserve it. But it feels like there is an obsession regarding downvotes these days...
The level of hypocrisy is just stunning. Telling about vote manipulation and selfishness and then upvoting himself for 13$. 🤮
Posted using Partiko Android
There is nothing wrong with self healing vs malicious blind downvotes. If the downvotes I received were because of reward disagreement I would not have healed. I send all of my rewards to the Steem DAO, so my vote is a donation anyway.
So your blind downvotes are righteous but blind downvotes you receive are malicious?
Posted using Partiko Android
If you notice, you're being downvoted by a lot of people, for buying votes. Give organic curation a try.
Non of them except one downvoted me manually (they don't even know what they are downvoting) and half of them use bid bots themselves.
Posted using Partiko Android
And another half are whales who just upvote themselves with a full stake. So your war against buying upvotes looks like a pure greed for the moment.
Posted using Partiko Android
I think it is great that you have brought this topic of conversation up. Personally, I think... that people are over complicating things now! It's like if it is not the one devil - it is the other! It reminds me a little the sports TMO - when you see something at real speed, it shows what happened - but then they slow it down and dissect it from a thousand angles and OFTEN, things slowed down can look a LOT worse than they really are.
The same can be said for getting into the nitty gritty here on Steem. Take my community for example. We are driven to support one another - so if you take it down to foundation level then we too, would be considered "circle jerkers" - which is utterly ridiculous. You cannot analyse things to that depth because what was once clear becomes distorted by obsession.
I caught wind today, that Steem Basic Income AND it's supporters are in the line of fire for whale downvotes. Now, whilst I understand that perhaps the model of SBI is no longer feasible on "new steem" - I cannot condone those that supported them for the purpose of contests etc. (myself included) now be punished because their "model" no longer suits the mould. That is a really negative case of micro-managing LOL
"FREE" market - interesting you brought that up. Personally, I have given a LOT of thought to that over the last month +. I completely agree with what you have said in terms of people can do what they please with the stake that they have purchased, but "using your teeth" comes a lot easier when you have a full set of 32 pearly whites. For those that have 10 and even less - biting into that piece of meat can be a little intimidating, especially when it comes to downvoting. You refer to reputation, (that little number which has proven to be completely worthless to me recently) and I would have thought this to hold some sort of relevance considering that I have EARNED every SCRAP of SP I own - but at rep 71, being a community head for over 2 years, and an active advocate for the platform I was still SO EASILY dragged through the mud - and that was simply because I stood up against COMPLETELY BIAS and inappropriate slander hurled in my direction. That took a major toll on my enthusiasm for ALL of my involvement here (for a moment)...
Imagine what that would do to someone who has 500 SP or has only been here a few months.
Everything is easier when you have power - and by power, I mean money.
I have made ONE downvote since HF21 and is not something I go out on a mission to do, but it would seem many have and are. I shared similar sentiment to yours in my server this evening about professionalism and not just that - but making the better choice. Things do not always go our way but how we handle those situations says a LOT about us as individuals and yes, those outcomes start to stack.
You have to find the positive way out in the most negative of situations. take the high road, be the bigger person and lighten the load! It is NOT always easy and YES we ALL fail at it at points, but the simple KNOWING that this is how it "should" be done is a means to an end!
This however, is NOT currently a reality here. And I say this quite frankly because I had that spoon shoved down my throat first hand. I have always avoided the politics, the conflict and the drama - but I stood up for myself ONCE and ALL the shit hit the fan! lol Many of the people roaming this space which have the "power" - are using it so destructively and like I said to a member in my PHC community about an hour ago -
It should not be like that!!!!
All in all, I think people need to fncking chill around here! Let people have their say, their opinion. Just bloody respect one another. You do not need to like one another to respect one another! I, and many others should not feel as "shriveled" for FEAR of loss. The world would not go round without diversity and even more importantly - your note at the end - the small stakeholders, put together.... would definitely be a wave on its own - it would be GREAT if the real "ploughers" on steem were afforded a little more respect.
If vote trading is circle jerking, I guess self voting is just jerking off.
I've always seen it as a slightly less enbarassing thing as self voting. Both can lead to reward disagreement. I think if 50% of rewards are organic, quality is average, and rewards aren't sky high....it's not a priority to downvote.
lmao. Most have been focused on the heavy abuse, but blatant blind vote traders, or "extravagant vote farmers" if you will, will be the next to be scrutinized.
That's very fair.
The worst people knew they would be targeted as soon as hf21 was announced.
The boarderline people had their time to adjust, some did....others, well they should have.
The nicest thing about all of this is people can adjust if they don't want a barrage of downvotes, it's their choice whether to adjust or resist.
I've seen several types of extravagant vite farmers, the issue here is they have a lot more supporters because they didn't enable full greed mode.
I anticipate a lot of bitterness and confusion. However there is enough content now to point the confused people to. Hopefully more are understanding why this medicine is being applied.
How is vote buying being manipulation ?
You buy ads all over the internet. Steems just sucks no one ever looks on the promoted section.
After 2 years of big players buying spots the only real way to compete now is buying a shit ton of steem or buying a vote or two so you can land on the trending page with a good quality article and get exposure and followers from that.
I thought steem corrected vote buying that it was no longer profitable anyways ?
Free downotes are what made vote buying no longer profitable.
Without downvoting a bid botted post, they will make ROI and hurt organic curation. You can get on trending for around $40 nowadays, esp if you get the votes quickly. There are plenty of "non-whales" that end up on trending organically now. Of course, not everyone will get on trending, as they could before, you have to actually earn it now.
Thank you for this, honestly trying to keep up with the changes and find all this information is near impossible when working a job and doing a bunch of stuff including trying to make something of Steemit. I appreciate the feedback and information and doing so in a kind way. So many people are still snap happy on here.
This is true Sir, at first when we we buying votes, some steemians who were fond in such act were not putting much effort, since they thought that any post could fetch them upvotes.
I know I have been on Steem too long when your title doesn’t even phase me. I am just like “Yea ... let’s talk about cicle jerks”. Meanwhile the person behind me in line looking over my shoulder is like “What the fuck is this weirdo in front of me reading?!?”
lmao, I guess it's just as bad that I didn't even think of the term circle jerks as what others outside of steem thinks it means. Too deep into Steem and the lingo has spilled over.
Sir @theycallmedan check my @threespeak post. Hope you like it sir
https://partiko.app/ahmanik47/koqcfsih?referrer=ahmanik47
Posted using Partiko Android
@theycallmedan, In my opinion no matter what we cannot reach to the Point Of Perfect Balance otherwise Humanity already would be living in Earthly Paradise. No matter it's Financial Space or Life everywhere we will going to see both Good and Evil forces. Stay blessed.
Posted using Partiko Android
Its a so initiative advice for us sir, i am always following your all task thats why its my another learning information. Thanks
Please sir chcek my @threespeak vlog.
https://partiko.app/ahmanik47/koqcfsih?referrer=ahmanik47
Posted using Partiko Android
good plan
Real talk, but "witness circle jerks" is a bad look/
bad reputation for Steemit. And i got already downvoted
and flagged on low value content, for downvoting them.
I like your Ego perspective... i taught my "dog" some manners,too ;)
Stronger Heart than Ego...
Yes, we need to use that negative vote in order to maintain our steem blockchain. Nice video man.
Lot of circle jerking is already happening and the top notch people doing that that makes it even worse
On steem?
Self proclaimed community watchdogs are actually hacking and stalking people.
This group https://steemit.com/@steemspeak is ran by https://steemit.com/@fyrstikken, They are hacking people that enter this discord server https://discordapp.com/invite/sqxV63P . Once you are hacked they profile you long enough to know all of your activities. They introduce workplace gangstalking visits and bring it to your attention cleverly and discretly so only you get it. They are very covert and tricky with everthing they say and do in this server. Some claim to have worked for or are working with the FBI and the NSA. Mixed with decomisioned traders and coding criminals, Its a scary mix of creepy people and thier intent is to drive you crazy and deplete everything you have ever aquired in life, even your freedom.
My hacking started with them introducing ransomeware that has options, dump my coin or delete my system drive. They acnowledged this to me in the server as it happened.
This hacking and stalking is done so they can manipulate the target to pump and dump for them. Threating and Making victims wear head phones, so nobody in your household can hear thier dramitization towards you. In 2017 this server was sidemarked as a drama show for entertainment purposes only as en excuse to say whatever they want all the way down to killing a politician. They have a server side command called "hey asshole" making a promt come up instructing everyone to wear headphones. They want everyone wearing headphones so nobody in your vicinity can hear them mess with you. Fystikken says its because of "mic feedback" but once your a target you get exactly why they make eveyone wear headphones.
With headphones on they subliminally direct victims with very low suggestive whispers mixed into their radio shows music. Combine this with them being able to manipulate their own individual outputs sound volume, which they control on the server side, they can pick what individual people hear and what at any given time. They decide who you hear on the server and change the volume controls for them. They can make some really low or off for those trying to investigate. They control who hears what and know who is who.
This team will find absolutely everything they can about you prior to using thier sugjestive and threatning program. They Introduce pictures that mean something only to the target, inducing paranoia while they watch and listen thru all of your circumvented devices. They are very aware of what makes you tick. They know your work schedule and use it for work stalking along side of this. I received multiple threating letters to my work and home addressed to my screen name from this group.
Fyrstikken tells people to sell their houses to buy crypto then dumps it on them. He has done many pump and dump scams. Quatloo being one of the first I witnessed and was done multiple times thru 2016 and 2017 them. It should be investigated for fraud. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=655793.0
Topic and Comments excellent discussions raised!
Very, very interesting video. A lot to unpack here and too much to type, but here's my brief thoughts off the top. No user is going to want to buy into a platform. I create content and I don't want to buy steem and lock it up, WTF. I want to create content. Some will invest in steem and have, but imo, it won't lead to mass adoption. Most people that buy steem are investors 1st and content creators 2nd. They create the bare minimum and have their homies upvote their shit.
I envision an equal playing ground for web 3.0, this leads to your socialism talk at the end of the video. (I wish you went deeper, had me hooked there). I don't want socialism, but I don't want the buy in, gain instant power based on how much you invested ecosystem we have now either. If I had a lot of money, I could buy a large sum of steem, instantly have huge influence, join an upvoting clique like so many here on steem and get my ROI. That's dumb.
A social platform should not be an ROI vehicle and if it is, it should be based on the quality of your content NOT based on how much you've invested. <- Main problem with steem.
How to start everyone on equal playing field and keep the rich influence out? IDK, but it's certainly interesting to think about and definitely the future imo. The problem with a trade able token is you're always going to have whales like you said. And is that even a problem? Do we want a non trade able token, does that make it worthless?
It's a very interesting discussion.
I was on a roll steeming ahead as a noob until I noticed the ones who got me into steem just circlejerking, I kept plugging away, then got hit with a roosterblocking type using their steempower to inhibit my posts getting anywhere (one owner of a few accounts) ...and I for the most part disappeared. Back on to see if anything has changed, a fork I guess the rest seems same old with steemfest, etc. There are some really great content creators I still resteem, but I think someone really pulled the public emergency brakes on the train....
Very nice! I like the way you clarify your view on handling our "teeth". I especially liked the point around reputation! Very good!
Dan, i had problems finding threespeak on discord, because i wanted
to talk to you/y'all about music videos...
Discord is new to me , but i opened up my server here:
https://discord.gg/pngbkEJ
We can talk like that too, but threespeak got it's own server on discord, right?
Greetings
Luca
Here is a detailed summary article about the key topics discussed in the episode:
Defining "Circle Jerks" and Downvoting Criteria
Dan begins by discussing the term "circle jerks" and what it means in the context of Steem. He prefers to use the term "reward disagreement" instead, as "circle jerks" can paint the wrong picture. Dan outlines his two main criteria for downvoting:
Differentiating Between Reward Farming and Legitimate Upvoting
Dan acknowledges that the line between reward farming and legitimate upvoting can be blurry. He makes a distinction between users who post low-quality content repeatedly to farm rewards, versus users who upvote their friends or connections, even if the content may not be the highest quality. Dan argues the latter scenario is more of a "gray area" that the community needs to collectively address.
The Role of Reputation and Long-Term Consequences
Dan emphasizes the importance of reputation on the Steem platform, especially as the value of STEEM increases. He argues that users who engage in abusive or manipulative behavior will face long-term consequences, as their reputation will follow them and limit future opportunities for collaboration and business connections.
Accepting Criticism and Avoiding Retaliation
Dan states that he personally does not retaliate against downvotes or criticism, as he believes it is important to be open to feedback and different perspectives. He argues that large stakeholders, in particular, should be willing to accept criticism and reward disagreements, as this will help improve the platform in the long run.
The Inevitability and Importance of Whales in Decentralized Ecosystems
Dan addresses the common criticism of "whales" on Steem, arguing that the presence of large stakeholders is inevitable in any decentralized, tradable token ecosystem. He contends that diversity of opinion and disagreement among whales is actually healthy for the platform, as it prevents a single agenda from dominating.
Overall, Dan's discussion highlights the nuanced challenges of maintaining standards and healthy discourse in a decentralized, stake-based platform like Steem. He emphasizes the need for the community to collectively address issues like reward farming and vote manipulation, while also recognizing the value that large stakeholders can bring to the ecosystem.
Notice: This is an AI-generated summary based on a transcript of the video. The summarization of the videos in this channel was requested/approved by the channel owner.