Why People Refusing To Work Is Actually A Good Thing

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We have a situation, it seems, that is really causing some issues.

Due to the fact that the Federal government is on a spending spree, many companies are finding they cannot hire employees. They are posting jobs but nobody is coming in. Some are even going so far as to pay people simply for applying.

The reason this is the case is that many people are making as much, if not more, than they were when working. The unemployment from their state along with the Federal money is provide more of an "income" than a job would.

Of course, this has business leaders up in arms and the right is jumping to the defense. Some states are now turning down the Federal money in an effort to push people back to work. This is short-sighted in my opinion.

The deal breaks down as such:

People are making more money on unemployment because the businesses do not play squat. It is really that simple. We are even seeing a number of McDonalds employees who are staging a "strike" on the day that corporation holds it annual meeting. This is done in effort to bring attention to their plight.

There is another challenge to all of this: workers arent paid squat because they bring very little to the table. Low skilled work equate to low pay. We have done very well at creating low end jobs that the skills of the average person are minimal.

Many say that workers should simply be paid more money. The problem is how much that affects the pricing of the products. Where I live, a "value" meal at McDonalds is already near $9. How much higher can it go?


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The reality of the situation is that we need to major shift in our economy. Generating jobs just so people have a place to go is moronic. The fact that companies are not finding workers is a good thing.

Why do I state this?

The answer is simple: it will force them to automate. We have been lagging behind the historic technological curve the last few decades. Much of this is due to the low productivity gains in construction. However, when we look at the lower end of the spectrum, not much has changed.

It is time to radically alter this.

Yes, if this happens, we will be confronted with a host of other issues. What do we do with all these out of work people? How can we support them all? Won't this create more inequality?

These are valid questions which are beyond the scope of this article. Certainly they will have to be addressed at some point regardless of what happens. The fact is we are automating more so we might as well start to take control of it.

We need to completely alter society. This is happening just in incremental stages. The challenge is that, at some point, it is all going to accelerate anyway. Sadly, with how people are behaving, we are going to be woefully unprepared for what comes.

The idea of creating bullshit jobs just so people have a place to go is bordering on inhumane today. When we look at the jobs many do, they are not sources of pride, satisfaction, nor healthy esteem. They also are not financially beneficial either.

In short, they are dead end jobs yet people have to work 45-50 hours a week just so they get some meager wages coming in. For many, this is basically a caste system for life. If there is a class change, it is usually down, from middle to lower income class.


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One of the reasons we have so many problems financially is because we see the growth rate rather anemic. Over the last 20 years, it steady dropped. The United States, which is the largest economy, has a nGDP that is below 4%. That is pathetic. It should be a mandated 7+% before the Fed even begins to start thinking about tightening. Until that point, they need to print like they never did before.

Innovation is a powerful way make this push forward. This will make companies more profitable, allow them to lower prices while maintaining margins, and eliminate a lot of headaches that come with workers. This will make the capitalists very happy while upsetting the socialists.

Of course, because of this, there will have to be some type of technological safety net. As deflation takes over due to automation, the Fed is going to have to offset that with a lot more money. Instead of providing money to Wall Street and the bankers, we will have to see a bunch of direct stimulus. This will make the socialists happy and upset the capitalists.

The present course of action is going to eventually find us in this situation anyway. However, instead of being proactive, we will find ourselves in a reactionary position.

Ultimately, I believe a lot of this is solved by turning toward crypto-economics. However, until the mainstream is ready for that, we will have to ensure these discussions.

In the meantime, we can start the march forward by increasing our productivity by automating all we can. Odds are the political "leadership" turns to the same ole tired solutions they always do which are ideologically driven.

That said, maybe they do get a bit creative and come up with something new like abolishing the income tax in favor of direct stimulus from the Fed.


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The idea of creating bullshit jobs just so people have a place to go is bordering on inhumane today. When we look at the jobs many do, they are not sources of pride, satisfaction, nor healthy esteem.

Taking it a step further, automation ultimately frees people to do what they are uniquely able to do: be creative and exercise judgment (two things no machine will ever be able to do, imho). Pride, satisfaction, and healthy esteem come from those two activities, and from knowing that you are improving the lives of others by producing something they value.

However, a no-strings-attached safety net will be needed during the transition to large-scale automation (which is fine, as long as it replaces all the current strings-attached welfare programs).


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Bullshit job is to harsh. It needs be more presice like Copy & Paste jobs or form completion jobs.

I could not agree more on the necessity of a no-strings-attached safety net.

I recently had a conversation with someone in the event industry about what the pandemic has done to her and her family finances. They're collecting unemployment benefits and her musician husband was being retrained for another line of work. Inflexible bureaucratic systems had been a major source of trouble for the couple.

UBI worth $1000 a month printed out of thin air and handed out to every adult but taxed away to a degree depending on other income would be the right way to go. That $1000 a month would be an absolute and unconditional income floor for everyone. It would allow for the necessary flexibility to seek temporary jobs and gigs or retrain if necessary without having to deal with any bureaucracy other than reporting the income or having it reported by the employers. All the bureaucracy involving unemployment benefits could be abolished. Massive money saved. The inflationary effect of the free money being doled out would be offset by the deflationary pressure caused by gains from increased automation.

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However, a no-strings-attached safety net will be needed during the transition to large-scale automation (which is fine, as long as it replaces all the current strings-attached welfare programs).

I think the likelihood of this happening are low. Politicians and bureaucrats do not have power if there are no string attached safety nets. They need to have strings so it enhances their power.

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I think machines already exercise judgement and it will only get more sophisticated.

Can you please explain how machines already exercise 'judgment'? I suppose it depends upon how one defines judgment. My view of judgment involves rationally going against what all the data would suggest you should do -- and machines cannot do that. Machines cannot evaluate all the data, conclude that the data say we should do "X" then decide to do "Y" based on some 'reason' that is not data-driven (and not merely something 'random').

I feel like AI can go in any direction we can and farther. The more data an algorithm has to analyze the more it can narrow down a conclusion. Isn't that the same thing we do? We take the data of our experiences and accessible knowledge and sift through the relevant parts to apply to an idea or situation and act based on the output of that data. As with us, if the parameters are set to process moral or ethical ideologies along the way they are considered or ignored based on priority set within the parameters. Or am I misunderstanding your question?

It looks like we have two different definitions of 'judgment' we are working with.

The ability to

take the data of our experiences and accessible knowledge and sift through the relevant parts to apply to an idea or situation and act based on the output of that data

does not constitute 'judgment' (according to my definition). Yes, machines and AI can do that (and do it better than we can). 'Judgment' is (according to my definition), when all that sifting through the data would lead you to decide to do "X" but you choose to do "Y" instead.

Embedded within my definition of judgment is the 'free will' argument. In other words, humans have free will and are able to exercise that free will by going against the data.

My short definition of 'judgment' is the ability to be 'rationally irrational'. I am 'irrational' in the sense that I am going against what the data (or algorithm) would tell me, but I am going against the data not out of some randomness or whimsical nature, but because I sincerely believe it is 'best' to go against the data. I may not even be able to explain 'why' I am going against the data, but I am actively choosing to do so, nonetheless.

There was a time I probably would have agreed with you out of hand, but lately I’ve been questioning free will and if it really even exists and I have landed on anything solid yet.

If one is primed to do something such that it feels wrong not to do it, even if it’s obviously wrong to do it, is there really a choice or is there just a default response?

lately I’ve been questioning free will and if it really even exists

This is the ultimate question to be grappled with, imho. If there is no free will, then we are all merely machines. And, if we are all merely machines, then the likelihood that other 'machines' (i.e. machine-learning algorithms and AI) overtake the human race is but a matter of time.

Also, if there is no free will, there is no morality -- how can an individual be held responsible for 'bad actions' when he/she had no choice in the matter? How can Thanos be 'evil' for wanting to annihilate half of all the beings in the universe?

Personally, I do not find the "there is no free will" argument compelling; however, I doubt I could ever present an adequate 'proof' that free will exists (other than the notion that our own conception of morality exposes something within ourselves that deeply begs the question -- similar to Descartes' "I think, therefore I am" -- I have an innate sense of right and wrong, therefore there must be some reason I have that sense, and a lack of free will would violate that reason).

However, like all things, that sense of right and wrong can become corrupt, can lose its bearings, can end up pointing an individual in the opposite direction. The fact that we possess a moral compass strongly suggests that we are free to choose one direction over another -- even if that compass is subject to various corruptions and/or misalignment or drift.

"If there is no free will, then we are all merely machines. And, if we are all merely machines, then the likelihood that other 'machines' (i.e. machine-learning algorithms and AI) overtake the human race is but a matter of time."

Take a look around :P

"Also, if there is no free will, there is no morality -- how can an individual be held responsible for 'bad actions' when he/she had no choice in the matter? How can Thanos be 'evil' for wanting to annihilate half of all the beings in the universe?"

Morality changes depending on the society one is looking at.

I never really considered Thanos evil... just misguided and lazy.

I know these aren't particularly stimulating well thought out responses, but I'm getting ready for work and a little short on time. My apologies.

I'm not convinced there is or isn't free will,.. I'm just struggling with it. A few years ago I was introduced to the concept that wheat domesticated humanity rather than the other way around and taking that into account with Sagan's theories on genetic drivers and it left me with a lot to sift through, lol. I hope I'll ponder this throughout the day and have a more compelling reply, but I didn't want to get stuck in a loop and just burn out before responding.

I'm sorry it's taken so long to get back to this. I hope the wait hasn't offended you.

Before I go on I'd like to re-iterate that I'm still on the fence on this topic and I'm just playing devil's advocate for the sake of interesting discussion and maybe debate.

I don't think morality is necessary in determining whether or not a threat should be removed. For instance, a wolf snatching a child from a village is a bad actor but morality doesn't factor in. From the wolf's perspective the hunting party that guns it down, either for revenge or simply to remove further threat, would be bad actors. It was only doing what wolves do.

When you say you have an inane sense of right and wrong, do you mean you believe it's something your born with? And do we have a moral compass, per say? Or do we just have a collection of chemical interactions and electrical impulses layered innumerable times and interwoven into what we perceive as such?

There are theories out there that with enough data everything can be predicted, even peoples’ behaviors. The advancement in weather prediction technology seems to support that.

The more data collected across the globe the more predictable the weather becomes. One could posit when the day comes when we’ve seeded the entire stratosphere (or wherever clouds roam) with nanobots we’ll be able to predict months out to the minute.

In closing, however, I’d like to stay on the fence. I came to the conclusion some time ago that there’s a very delicate mix of random and predetermination at play simply because humanity isn’t driving force behind life. The earth itself is a living organism and we’re but one part of it.

I also gravitate toward the idea that we’re more or less a “micro organism” in a recently fertilized embryonic universe and are equivalent to whatever builds the neural network of our own brains in utero. The cycle of life seems pretty consistent to me. I don’t see any reason to doubt it’s the same all the way up. Not to be confused with turtles all the way down, though. 😁

Edit to add: I wonder if the fertilization of a human egg replicates the Big Bang. We know it’s not a case of nothingness to sudden everything, but we have the benefit of an overview. Considering theories on dark matter and other cosmic intellectualism well beyond my comprehension maybe we’re to small to see the nothingness is really something.

The reason this is the case is that many people are making as much, if not more, than they were when working.

That’s one of the reasons, but there are others. I heard a story on the radio a few days ago about a lack of childcare that was causing people to not go back to working since the childcare facilities the people had been using before Covid had gone out of business, a bit of a Catch-22.

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Childcare is also quite expensive.

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That is true but when you look at the percentage of worker aged people, those with small children is a rather small percentage as compared to the whole. Certainly a piece of the equation but only about 15% are affected. This leaves 85% who could fill those jobs if they were inclined.

But why should they? It is like the work from home discussion: why should workers return to the office if they have a better deal working at home. No commute. Saving on food and travel. Work in your jammies.

Society doesnt do well as paradigm shifts are taking place and we see a lot of them happening.

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As bad as the pandemic has been and I got hit hard with the virus itself, but the many eye-opening things that came out of it perhaps was not so bad. It’s evident that it just rushed the process of what eventually was going to happen.

We needed a kick in the ass and hopefully this country can start making some real earth shattering moves.

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Well the "leadership" at the government level is completely incompetent. That is both Federal and State. So I would not expect a lot of help there. Corporations are going to do what is best for them which is, obviously, to automate as much as they can to solve these problems.

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This is a huge issue especially in the restaurant industry. Takeout and delivery haven't slowed down at all and they cannot handle the volume that is being thrown at them. This causes delivery drivers to get backed up, and that causes us to not be able to make the money we need to make when we are waiting on food all the time.

It is also causing issues with truck drivers, namely tanker truck drivers which they are saying is going to lead to a national gas shortage... which is coming just in time for my planned cross country trip, lol. Fun times we live in, lol

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All of that is taking place. And it does create an opportunity. Autonomous trucking is being worked on. The last mile of delivery is also being researched. As well as the "dark" restaurants. Each of these areas you described already is in the process of going automated. It might take a few more years but they will get there.

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Not a bad thing to get into the forefront of...

I like your thought patterns, even though we sometimes arrive at different conclusions.

Keep 'em coming ...


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Thanks. Will do.

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How is a situation like this allowed to happen by government though?

In Australia, the emergency government subsidies for those that lost work due to Covid were short term and have mostly already been stopped.

Seriously, who is making these decisions and how don't the state and federal governments talk to each other?

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Don't even get me started on how the hiring process discriminates in favor of humans.👽

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LOL yes well Purple Dinosaurs do not have a union backing them.

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Yeahhhh boy! Spot on. Nailed it with this post 100% love it

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Either way at some point the public will have a reckoning with the economy. If people think unemployment is better than working then eventually the prices will have to go up enough to reflect the increase in labor prices. This will cause the socialists to clamor for even more larger minimum wage and its a never ending cycle. So the price point for automation being cheaper than human labor will become mainstream. So I see no future for the current structure.

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If people think unemployment is better than working then eventually the prices will have to go up enough to reflect the increase in labor prices.

And this is exactly what makes the advancement of automation take off. As the labor rates increase, the incentive to automate follows the same pattern because the ROI becomes more appealing.

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The reason this is the case is that many people are making as much, if not more, than they were when working. The unemployment from their state along with the Federal money is provide more of an "income" than a job would.

If I had customer facing job, I really would think twice about going back straight to work.
I saw some small employeers start give their employees more insentives like college intuition. Sure that is good thing, but how can they effort that now or willing to pay instead of paying the employee more in first place.
Carrot and stick, I guess. Fördern und Fordern.

It is a rough situation especially when you are in an industry where a major increase in prices is not possible. There is a point where one can price itself out of the market especially if it entails discretionary spending.

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Wait until the major finds about crypto.

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Yeah and then the word will really see how different things are.

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Well, we have talked about this before on Leo Chat and you know I couldn't agree more.

It's going to happen, there's no point fighting it so we should be doing our best to try and plan ahead for that new situation.

Ultimately, I believe a lot of this is solved by turning toward crypto-economics. However, until the mainstream is ready for that, we will have to ensure these discussions.

This is one of the keys that will unlock the solution in my point of view

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It is a new system that either ignores both the right and the left or embraces both sides, depending upon how you look at it. We can see the foundation being put in place. The establishment is scrambling to take hold of things. That is why we have to keep pushing away from it.

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I'll be honest, I didn't read the article, but this came across my feed this morning. It is CNN, so you have to assume it is going to lean far left, but here you go:

https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/11/economy/unemployment-benefits-work-incentive/index.html

Based on what you are saying here, it seems that we need to stop worrying about the jobless rate so much and start thinking about how we are going to sustain everyone. As much as people hate it, the "socialist" ideas of universal basic income and things like that might be more relevant than they wan to admit. If things move towards automation there likely will be many people who don't need to work. How will they live then. Your idea of a fundamental economic shift becomes a bit of a gut punch when you start thinking about that reality.

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Sadly it turns into a political issue these days, which everything does. However, the reality is that both sides are going to have to accept some hard truths about what is taking place.

Fortunately, I do not see the decentralization trend slowing down. That is going to put the right on guard since they are going to be attacked via a mass decoupling with their present system. The left will find the same thing as people find ways other than depending upon the nanny state.

It is going to be an interesting few years going forward.

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It sounds like it for sure! I need to be doing what I can now to make sure I am not on the wrong side of this whole thing I think. The idea of both sides agreeing on something these days seems like a foreign concept!

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They are posting jobs but nobody is coming in. Some are even going so far as to pay people simply for applying.

I only this can happen in my place that would be great. but things are pretty different here. We are still don't have jobs opening after the pandemic hits.

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if low skilled jobs are lost due to automation, those people that don' work in those fields anymore should be helped ( with direct money, low taxes, free tuition etc) to get some relevant skills that will benefit both themselves and society

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The deal breaks down as such:

People are making more money on unemployment because the businesses do not play squat. It is really that simple.

Yes, Yes, Yes. Finally someone gets it. This is unfortunately a big problem with the right. The trumpers and the whoever elsers. They are the first people to scream oh its socialism.. see what happens people wont work they'll just sit down. Let me give you all another way to look at it. Let's look at it like its not socialism but it is fascism and it is corporatism and it is the governments buddied up with the companies and they are using government power and laws and propaganda to keep people poor and sickly.

Instead of looking at it like oh its socialism let's look at it like that for starters. Yes, maybe the reason people aren't going back to work is suggesting that the companies should be ashamed of themselves for paying people that little money and expecting them to just take it. No that lie about minimum wage stops job creation. That's another lie the right tells far too much. if they get tired of robbing people and giving it to their shareholders guess what someone else who doesn't rob people or take advantage of people will fill in the gaps. So they can stop all that lobbyist bs second.

Third, this is a a chance for the cryptocurrency space to find their use case and address problems like these. We don't need new businesses on teh blockchain. We need new systems . new monetary systems that help to combat this problem. I've started one bitcoin myk and bbd coin and we get alot of vocal support . where is the physical support huh? It's time we started specifically addressing this not going in circles pointing it out is great.

However we need to do something with the chain that specifically can address that. We got ample opportunity and we got ample money and resources so lets do something about that. The good news is most people are going to tire of this nonsense. They will tire and they going to stop the far right lies. THey going to take action against all the propaganda and debunk it . .It's not a question of if but when.

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I like your thinking pattern you're doing well it's nice you are leading up but perception of everyone is different so every person explain it differently.As bad as pandemic has been reached it destroyes everyone's routine towards their business and jobs .so online world is really helpful for decreasing unemployment. I believe that leo platform is really good crypto economics also decrease unemployment.

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