Is your engagement fake or not? [POB]
Sit there and hold on, because here comes a controversial text maybe ...
This is a question for you to reflect and think for yourself. What is your real motive or commitment behind this?
@calumam and @fireguardian create contests here on POB to encourage users to write, create good content, win prizes and, above all, have their engagement ...
One of the rules for winning is having a good engagement. This means that you need to go out reading and commenting on various posts from various people who are participating. I even commented to @calumam that I don't care about the prize itself whether I will win or not. I'm just writing and helping to "spread" the contest, and the proposed themes make me wake up to write, which I like. But when it comes to engagement, I know that I will never win (at least for now), due to my time and responsibilities that I have on a daily basis. Even to write a post a day with good content is already being tight for me ... So, if I win, it would just be a consequence. But, I am aware of that and I am not concerned. I always try to read the posts of those who always visit me, comment and who I follow.
But, do you know what I've noticed? That fake interaction (and I'm not talking about the general), but I notice some cases where the person just leaves the comment to say that he "did his part" that he "interacted" and to count "points" for the contest. Friend, I'll be honest. If you are forced to comment on it, you don’t even have to. My interaction will not even be reciprocal and I will hardly go there to read your posts.
Now, there are those who come, read, and leave sensational comments regarding your posts. This I feel with a real interaction and engagement. Okay, maybe in the end you are doing this because of the contest only, but even if it is because of this, you are writing and doing what was correctly proposed by @calumam and @fireguardian. I often read some posts but I can't come up with a satisfactory answer or comment, so I don't even try, just vote.
Doing for just doing is much worse than not doing. So I ask you again: Are you really interacting or just superficial?
Ah, and there is one more thing. We are in the POB tribe where we have to test our brain, and then man ... Please, we realize when something is not what it seems to be xD
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PORTUGUÊS
Senta aí e se segura, porque aqui vem um texto polêmico talvez...
Essa é uma pergunta para você refletir e pensar para si mesmo. Qual o seu verdadeiro motivo ou empenho por atrás disso?
@calumam e @fireguardian criam concursos aqui no POB para incentivar os usuários a escrever, criar bom conteúdo, ganhar prêmios e principalmente ter seu engajamento...
Uma das regras para vencer é ter um bom engajamento. Isso faz com que você precise sair lendo e comentando em vários posts de várias pessoas que estão participando. Eu mesmo comentei com @calumam que eu não ligo para o prêmio em si se eu irei ganhar ou não. Estou apenas escrevendo e ajudando a "espalhar" o concurso, além de que os temas propostos me fazem despertar para escrever, o que eu gosto. Mas na questão do engajamento eu sei que nunca irei ganhar (pelo menos por enquanto), devido ao meu tempo e minhas responsabilidades que eu tenho no dia a dia. Até para escrever um post por dia com bom conteúdo já vem sendo apertado para mim... Então, se eu ganhar, seria apenas consequência. Mas, eu estou ciente disso e não me preocupo. Tento sempre ler os posts de quem sempre me visita, comenta e de quem eu sigo.
Mas, sabem o que eu tenho notado? Aquela interação fake (e eu não estou falando do geral), mas eu noto alguns casos onde a pessoa apenas deixa o comentário para dizer que "fez sua parte" que "interagiu" e para contar "pontos" para o concurso. Amigo, vou ser sincero. Se for para fazer comentário forçado a isso, nem precisa fazer. A minha interação nem vai ser recíproca e eu dificilmente irei lá ler seus posts.
Agora, tem aqueles que vem, leem, e deixam comentários sensacionais referente o seu posts. Isso eu sinto com uma verdadeira interação e engajamento. Tudo bem que talvez no fim você esteja fazendo isso por causa do concurso apenas, porém mesmo que seja por causa disso, você está escrevendo e fazendo que foi proposto corretamente pelo @calumam e @fireguardian. Eu muitas vezes leio alguns post mas não consigo bolar uma resposta ou comentário satisfatório, então eu nem tento, apenas voto.
Fazer por só fazer, é muito pior do que não fazer. Então eu lhe pergunto novamente: Você está interagindo de verdade ou apenas superficial?
Ah, e tem mais uma coisa. Estamos na tribo POB onde temos de por a prova nosso cérebro, e então cara... Por favor, a gente percebe quando algo não é o que parece ser xD
Yup, it's an insult as far as I'm concerned (maybe a bit over the top, lol). I'm considering following along with amr008's engagement project more closely and if there are clear signs of empty comment spamming I'm tempted to start laying out the downvotes. It's huge @proofoflame.
ps. well done, you managed to get a comment out of me later in the day, lol.
It's an interesting idea the way you think about how to approach it.
So they will think twice before just spamming comments for the contest post.
I kind of mixed up the message of your post with my own thoughts about empty comments across the whole platform. I understand where @yintercept is coming from in his comment, there is an art to some of the more plausible looking empty comments, but when you get down to it they're meaningless.
My concern is with @amr008's engagement project within the POB community. I've noticed some accounts which rank well within his script and receive heavy upvotes when the majority of the comments are quite frankly garbage. I don't see this as proof of brain and I feel like it's a fair use of downvote for disagreement of rewards (I'm not sure how this would affect @amr008.pob's curation rewards, plus I wouldn't want to hinder dividends ((will probably get strangled in my sleep)) and the accounts growth).
Well as I have mentioned many times and I have posted many times too , I have done my best to make the script choose the best engagers .
I have manually checked number of comments to see how the upvotes are working .
That is the reason the upvote is based upon "Quality" and not number of comments.
I can understand your point but I would like to explain why you may easily misunderstand the upvotes .
Let's take a user named Brick for example .
Now brick makes the following comments .
2nd comment - This just telling the need for more decentralization in the online world . We have been seeing a lot of bans and shadowbans on twitter and FB and other centralized media . This is where Hive can pitch in and show the world what it is capable of . Eventually we will see more and more users hop on here , we just have to keep promoting Hive .
3rd comment - This post increased my knowledge thanks .
Now the script runs through all the comments and calculates various stuff like
1 . Number of comments .
and many more .
Eventually it assigns a "Quality" Score and picks up a random link of the user comment . Now remember , this is the tricky part .
Now the brick user did put some effort into 3 comments and did make good quality comments overall . Now the bot may pick 3rd comment and upvote it .
Now when you see that , what will you think ? Oh such a big upvote for some BS comment which says " This post increased my knowledge thanks . " But in reality , the upvote is not for that particular comment but for all the comments collectively .
I hope you got my point .
Thanks for laying it all out, I do not doubt your script at all, I just notice that there have been some users who have bypassed it somewhat. It's not necessarily the upvote on the comment, I understand that the upvotes are based on a range of comments and the bot selects the last comment they posted or something along those lines (I know quite well, I've received plenty of upvotes from you).
I'm just wondering how it would affect your curation rewards and dividends if there was some downvoting based on disagreements "for the overall range of comments" taking your process into consideration. Not sure if others will agree with me here, I just think people who repeat this spammy meaningless bs shouldn't be rewarded from an engagement project (just my opinion and thoughts based on the POB concept).
I am not really sure about how it affects curation rewards to be honest but if you decide to downvote someone after finding them spamming , please do . Eventually we shall all work together for those posts and comments which actually contributes positively to the project .
I also post all the numbers on https://hivelayers-stats.herokuapp.com . Please check it out for POB section where you will see all the users upvoted and the unique comments they made and similar comments .
It has details for all the dates up until today .
Magic, I'll go over that tomorrow and will see if any names stick out. Maybe I'm being a bit judgemental and a bit of a dick, but I really don't see how these spammy meaningless comments bring any value to the platform, and to see it getting better rewards than some great posts just rubs me up the wrong way.
I totally understand your point of view .
On LeoFinance if you check , there are 5-6 users who make considerable amount of comments but actually doesn't get even 1% upvote . Why ? because the top 25 users out qualify them with their quality comments .
That is what I expect from POB too , eventually the quality comments will overtake the non-quality comments .
If the algorithm is running perfect for that, that's great.
This averages and checks.
It really is okay for someone to come and just comment vaguely ... Since the other posts made decent comments.
I agree on that part.
Of course, whenever I notice that I'm going to end up commenting something very vague and in order not to look like that, I always take a part of the post from the person who drew my attention the most to this comment that I will make and make a quote and a comment. above. Making it clear that I really read ... Although there are cases of circumventing that too ... But it's one thing at a time lol
Yes @hranhuk, I agree with that....
this is satire, showing how easy it is to bypass it. I see it all the time
To be honest , even this comment added some value to POB . You just don't know it :P lol .
Also this comment might have been flagged as similar comment by my script . Let's check it tomorrow .
I have manually checked it many times to make sure it is working as I want it to work and I randomly check couple of users every day to see if the bot is assigning quality correctly .
If someone still finds something wrong , I will definitely try my best to fix it and improve the script .
Yes, exactly. I also understand the point of view that he brought.
The survey here was the question of POB, the way of being POB
Since we have to test it all the time, and speaking particularly of contests, this is where I wanted to go with vague and often generic and automatic comments. Which would suit all posts around the world, just changing one word for a more similar one.
you're right @hranhuk, great comment....
alright, I'll stop, lol.
You understood very well the way to use this lol
Also , the project upvotes 25 users.
Now if it votes some BS comments of users that means there are just not many users who are in top 25 .
But the quality can go to 0 . In other words
Say you make 3 comments in which 2 comments are similar / copy paste then the quality will become 0 or negative and automatically the user doesn't get the upvotes .
I have carefully designed all this to make sure spammers won't get rewarded huge . If you still find some examples of evidences , please feel free to tag me and tell me about it . I will make sure I will take additional steps .
Also when it comes to rewards , I am not sure if you know or not , I don't take any cut . In fact I give away 25% of my own curation awards to other delegators . My project is purely focused on increasing engagement as well as rewarding delegators who cannot curate themselves , I haven't been on the profit end any week since part of my profits are also distributed among others .
Alright this makes sense, I'll make sure to drop you a tag if I stumble onto any. I understand that it'll even out once there are more users involved, so that is good to know.
I see, that's good to know. Well, it's pleasant to hear that, I'll be sure to support you even further.
I have left a detailed response below of how it all works . Check it out .
I was reading them all.
I didn’t know about the work you’ve been doing regarding comments and the way you’re checking.
This is great for the health of the tribe
In fact, I am very happy now to know all of this. Gradually we are leaving more fluid and only the "real pob" will be rewarded correctly.
I guess my "M'eh" bot idea for posts should also be for comments.
From what I have seen in the years I have been with Steem/Hive is that actual discussion happens very rarely. If you have a controversial topic with a couple of whales fighting to up/down vote an article to neutrality, you'll usually have plenty of comments on either side of the discussion. But, in general, the actual interaction from followers is probably near 1% or less.
Everyone is trying to get their share of the pie and it is much easier to do the minimal effort for the reward.
And I don’t even think it’s wrong who’s there trying to get noticed and win something
But my case that I drew attention to is more due to the unwillingness to participate correctly than just that ...
Ding!
I just scored an engagement point!
While I think it is good for Hivers to think about their intentions before dropping a comment. I feel that it is a mistake for bloggers to waste time trying to judge the intention of the comments that they receive.
HIVE is a social network platform. I assume that most comments are really just attempts at social networking.
Personally, I like to leave comments that contribute some substance to a thread. However, I have learned through the years that people can easily misread the intent of the comments.
For example, I used to play the game where I would mention an alternative point of view of a topic thinking that it would make the thread more lively. The blogger would then approach my comment as if it were a declaration of war.
Having seen attempts to add substance to a thread through comments go awry, I've come to appreciate the people who've mastered the art of communicating with vague substance-free comments.
I agree with your point of view on this type of view.
I don't particularly care about that kind of thing ...
What I wanted to raise in question and bring a healthy discussion, was about the comments for the contest.
Is the way you are doing it right or wrong? Remembering that right and wrong depends on the vision of each one. And we are at POB, my idea is to always approach something that makes people think and reflect. Just as it is happening now here lol
Thank you for expressing your opinion ^^
That is why before leaving a comment that will only leave a gap, or only display, I prefer to give a positive vote if I like the post, but if I have to contribute with the author or ask that is where I use the comments. It is as you say, there are people who comment only to meet requirements, not because of commitment to the community, or to seek a good interaction with the author and the post.
Exactly that @celi130
That is the point that I also make here.
É uma situação que acontecia desde a época do Steemit, sempre vai haver os: -Very good post! I follow you, follow me back!
Eu particularmente assumo que no primeiro contest que participei semana passada vacilei em praticamente nem comentar nos posts dos outros concorrentes, não por que eu não queria ou estava sendo arrogante, mas sim por que nessa correria que você bem conhece temos que decidir se vamos escrever um post, votar, comentar ou o oque, já tenho trocado até mesmo o plano de postar todo dia. Não tem sido possível, então tem dias que tenho só votado e comentado. Mas enfim, eu percebi a importância "nesse concurso" em interagir mais quando vi a lista de interações que o @calumam publicou junto com os vencedores! Ótima ideia, mostrar como anda as interações entre os membros, isso é que fará muita diferença! E a gente sabe bem, é interagindo que se formam as correntes mais resistentes e funcionais!
Enfim, acho que vamos aprendendo pouco a pouco, quem está comprometido, provavelmente irá ver esse seu post com bons olhos e aceitar a crítica!
Com certeza. Acho que isso existe em todos os lugares e não só aqui. Basta jogar online que terá aqueles que vivem no chat pedindo sem esforço.
Meu post foi mais uma prova de cérebro que é o tema central. Se a gente se julga merecedor de POB, temos de ser diferentes, fazer diferente, parar com essas coisas e manias e achar que está tudo bem
Mas no final, não vou ligar se tudo continuar como está... Só saberei quem é quem realmente hahaha
Depois de mais de três anos participando da blockchain... Falso engajamento é uma coisa que eu já consigo perceber de longe, viu? Haha!
Infelizmente, esses usuários sempre irão existir e não sei se algum dia eles irão desaparecer por completo. Mesmo que alguns deles mudem (ao perceberem que estão agindo de maneira errada), eles não irão parar de surgir.
Fato!
Acho que isso é aquela porcentagem que sempre irá existir por aí
Não importe quanto a gente lute