Custodial Services

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Let's be honest.

Most people that read this blog already know more about crypto than the average person will in their entire lifetime. That is a fact, and we should stop pretending otherwise. The early adopters who got in on the ground floor of this thing are obviously going to show way more interest and put way more time/effort into learning this stuff. This is our job now, and I plan on getting paid handsomely for it.

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Expectations vs Reality

Anyone who expects that everyone is going to be running their own node in the future, or that everyone will secure their own keys, or that everyone will create quality content, or that everyone will XYZ via altruism/idealism ... is going to be sorely mistaken. Those who actually make bets to this effect and put their money in places that rely on utopian philosophy are going to have a bad time.

The average person will always be average.

This was something that blew my mind back when I was playing poker for a living. No matter how good I got, the average person at my tables never got any better. Mindblowing! How is that even possible? Are they not even trying? Are they action junkies that just do it for the rush of the risk?

What's going on here?

For the most part this is a surprisingly simple equation. For every good player that burns out and leaves the grind, two more newbies are going to take his place. There's a sucker born every minute. Haven't you ever wondered why the economy suffers every time population goes down and demographics morph into a different shape other than a pyramid? The entire economy is a pyramid scheme that DEPENDS on taking candy from the baby.

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AH! FRESH MEAT.

Like it or not, this is the world we live in.
A meat grinder unsurprisingly grinds meat.
That is its function.

Yeah, but what is the point though?

The point is that people don't care about security until they get hacked. People don't care about game-theory or the underlying technology or "disruption" or "innovation" or anything else.

What people actually care about is convenience.

  • That's it.
  • Was it quick?
  • Was it easy?
  • Did I get the most value out of my effort for the least work possible?
  • These are the questions people ask.
  • Not: is it decentralized?

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That's reality.

And we must pivot to supply that demand.

Again, let's be honest.

  • Someone creates a Hive account.
  • That account is worth $0.
  • But we expect them to spend hours figuring it all out?
  • On the off-chance they might get rewarded later?
  • Maybe?
  • That's dumb.

That's projection.

We expect other people to claw and scrape just like we did when we first started out. But again, we are the grizzled early adopters. It would be downright foolish to project early adopter mentality onto mainstream adoption mentality. No no no: that's not going to work.

So yeah, there will be a lot of backsliding and compromises. We have to create centralized solutions if we expect to get users to transition from a centralized web 2.0 to a decentralized WEB3, and that's fine.

Again, it doesn't matter if one trustworthy counterparty has access to 100k accounts if all those accounts are worth very little in terms of value stored on them. This is especially true with Graphene's ability to recover accounts.

What is the worst that could happen?

Thousands of dollars get stolen in a hack? That is an acceptable loss when paired against the gain of everyone perfectly understanding how to interact with the platform right from the beginning. Convenience wins. User experience wins.

So what do we have to do?

Nothing really... it's already happening. Splinterlands will be a major custodian. So will LeoFinance and 3Speak. These are all extremely trustworthy entities that we can trust to store the newbie's private keys on their servers.

There's certainly still a lot more work to do rather than just setting up email/password accounts in place of securing private keys. In addition to that we must also gamify the experience of learning about how all this works. Frontends must be created that provided focused baby-step instruction as to how this all works. Each frontend will clearly be a little different, because each frontend serves a different purpose. Someone who learns about Hive from Splinterlands isn't going to be learning about it in exactly the same way as someone from LeoFinance would. This makes perfect sense, as one platform is a game and the other is an investment forum.

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Even a hack is a hard & valuable lesson.

Remember the dreaded @belemo hack?

https://peakd.com/hive-167922/@edicted/crowdfund-belemo

One person loses $10k, the community secures millions.

So many people on Hive got a hardware wallet because of this news.
This also shows the importance of communication and community.
Stuff like this doesn't happen elsewhere.
Hive is where it's at.

Conclusion

Own your own account.
Own your data.

Unless you're new, in which case provide your email/password like everyone else. We already see what happens to networks who ignore reality. Reality swoops in and punishes them for it. How many mining pools does Bitcoin have? That's centralized. How many wallets on Ethereum control 90% of the coins? That's centralized.

Rather than rage about how things are supposed to be, we need to lean into how they actually are, or we will be swept away by the truth that we are refusing to acknowledge. This is one of those few cases where perception is not reality. Sooner or later the real-world comes along and slashes game-theory to ribbons. We would do well to remember this fact.

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34 comments
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agree I follow not your key not your crypto rule cause I have lost crypto before

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In defense of us average people... we already have so much to deal with and think about... and in a world of single signons and your face being your password, custodial crypto sites have to be just as good if not better than the super dodgy centralized entities everyone is used to.

I still know heaps of cybersecurity people that are lazy with their own passwords... it's just... such a chore that makes things harder.

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I think it's a very interesting situation for various reasons.

The first of which that we can't really compare Hive custodians to WEB2.
On centralized social media it is expected that you would get censored in certain situations.
Hive custodians will not be expected to take any such actions.
And if they do it could be very VERY bad for their reputation.

I also think it will be very easy to streamline the process of self-custody.
To the point of making memorizing a master password quite trivial and also secure.

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I hope so... it's obviously going to be devastating for people if they lose years of 'work' by either losing their keys or getting hacked.

I still reckon censorship doesn't worry like 95% of internet users... I just don't think people care. The opportunity to earn for their efforts, is a much bigger motivator... but with creators I've spoken to, the number 1 factor is the eyeballs. People want the attention more than anything else.

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AH! FRESH MEAT.

That sound used the scare the living hell out of me as a kid playing that god-forsaken game. Good times.

In addition to that we must also gamify the experience of learning about how all this works.

This. Working in an ed-tech I see it firsthand every day. It's incredible how easier it is for students to learn something when they have a gamified user journey.

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The average person will always be average.

Away from the words of human development and motivation, but you are right. We must work as a group, and this is the basis.

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I love this.

Just like waiting for the "masses". Sorry, the masses don't understand 4 keys, instead of one password, they don't get what keychain's job is. They honestly come to peakd and still feel like they haven't found Hive.. Because no one told them to come to Peakd, or one of the others.

We are terrible, and I DO mean terrible at dumbing this whole thing down, and that is fine... As long as you don't want the masses.

:)

And yeah, people with full times jobs, and kids and hobbies, probably don't want to spend hours figuring it out so they can learn the rules, which are totally different depending on who tell you about them, usually accompanied by an insult and a downvote. lol For rules that aren't listed anywhere, and enforced by people who like to name call and think others are stupid for getting here not knowing the rare and totally strange rules of Hive. :)

I love those who have figured it for the most part and we roll on slowly picking up those who have thick skin, time to spend on it and motive enough to learn the ropes.

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(Edited)

You are SPOT ON my friend. I love the HIVE community and the tech is great, but HIVE and STEEM both do a terrible job at making it easy for noobs. HIVE is the most complicated system I have ever seen and things are not explained well. having 4 different keys for different things is ludicrous, and needlessly complex and making your private key the default login always was and still is a terrible and unsafe design choice. TONS of detail is also lacking in the documentation...I have been in crypto since 2010, and have been trading crypto since 2013 and invested in and used probably 40 different blockchains over the years and even I did not understand some things.

I hope that HIVE will continue to improve over time, I want this place to succeed and keep growing!

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Security for most people early on isn't that necessary as they have 0-a few hundred bucks in the early days of learning and they could use "advanced" wallet features when they cross some magical line like $500, or when they elect to turn on advanced features. That could easily take it to 2 keys. Your posting key and the one we call active. Which could be renamed to "Wallet" key. So, you'd use one key for posting activities and one for financial transactions. :) Some of the apps are trying really hard to simplify things.

We are working on it, the hard part is for a lot of the people around have been around forever and we forget how hard it is.

I recently helped my son make a splinterlands account, he's a gamer, works on computers, etc. He got so frustrated trying to understand it all! :)

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I hear you @whatsup
I tried to onboard my boys, it took a few tries, they kept walking away saying it was to complicated. If it wasn't for Splinterlands they would still be on the sidelines. Now they are willing to learn.

But between four keys, Hive Signer and Hive Engine, it very complicated and throw in the glithces and they are very frustrated at times.

Truth is this ecosystem is very complicated and those of us who have been here 3-4 years have forgotten how hard it is...until we try to onboard someone and then ... it is an eye opener.

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Yes, HIVE Signer is a step forward since your private key is not at risk, but it does have glitches sometimes. There still needs to be a lot of improvement done.

Great point about the veterans forgetting how hard it is for newcomers, that is very true, thank you for sharing,

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I agree with you 100%!
I love that it improves security, but when it doesn’t work it’s very hard to retrace your steps and the questions it asks newbies are in an unfamiliar and unclear language. It’s tough to explain too. 🤨

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Thanks for sharing your experience, did you guys eventually get the Splinterlands account setup and working ok? Honestly I think they should just simplify things and make it 2 keys instead of 4: posting/publishing key + wallet key...simple.

I do hope that things can be streamlined and simplified gradually on HIVE as we move forward though.

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We are terrible, and I DO mean terrible at dumbing this whole thing down, and that is fine... As long as you don't want the masses.

Lol. Funny as it. Hive is quite complex and if we want the masses we need to put in more simplicity.

I just remember few days ago I was trying to explain some of these keys and all that to a few people I was bringing into Hive, but after everything some still don't get it. Still had issh logging it. A friend told me directly, this thing is complex.

Talking about rules, it would make sense if some rules of the blockchain are popped up immediately after signing up or even placed in the password backup file so they can read and get to understand some things to prevent them from breaking some rules which might need to some discouraging downvotes.

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The clue is in the name. Game 'Theory'.

It never ceases to amaze me that some people are so delusional that they believe that game theory is a representation of real life rather than just another theory used in simulations?

Baffling!

I'm with you on this one. Average is good.

Aim for average and we will overshoot expectations rather than seeking excellence which is impossible for 99% of the population. 👨‍💻👍

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I agree that 90-95% of folks will just want whatever is easiest + do almost ZERO research. Until they lose money from their complete ignorance, then a decent chunk of those people will start to learn to avoid feeling that pain again. Pain and fear are great motivators. For those of us that actually understand the importance of security that being your own bank entails, we should never stop trying to get others to learn though, even though many wont listen.

Dont waste your time on people who wont listen though, stick with the folks who at least make and effort.

Lastly, this is a good time to remind folks that 3rd party custodians are not without risks too. For one they are a 100000x bigger target for hackers. Furthermore, for most exchanges your account can be closed and they may or may not KEEP your money for basically any reason, and they dont even need to tell you what the reason is, "fOr SeCuRiTy rEaSoNs". And even for DeFi where the admins do not have access to your money, the smart contract itself is a risk, due to possible vulnerabilities.

If you just have a measly $50 in crypto or whatever then ehhh, I guess it doesnt matter too much I suppose, but once the number starts approaching anywhere near an amount that would HURT if you lost it, I suggest that everyone start doing their homework thoroughly. Or just do it right and learn a bit more each day right in the beginning, and before you know it you will be fluent in your knowledge of the space.

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Until they lose money from their complete ignorance, then a decent chunk of those people will start to learn to avoid feeling that pain again. Pain and fear are great motivators.

You know what, somehow I just find this funny but it's true. Others just want something easy without having to do any research or stress but when they see a painful mistake others make, they adjust and tighten up. As you said, pain and fear are great motivators.

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I've been on Hive a while and I still prefer easy to complex. That's the nature of reality, completely agree

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We are up from 12k daily transacting accounts to 15k, not too shabby.
We were at 12k for a long time.
If we 10x that we also slice the pie into much tinier pieces.
If the network effects make that worthwhile it's great, but there is no guarantee that is how the cookie crumbles.
But, I'd be happy to try.

I think our hope lies in the currency aspects far more than the blog for pay aspect.

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Hi @edicted
I agree, mass adoption will require ease of use like Leoinfra, and hand holding. I suspect services which custody the keys and possibly the crypto will be successful. I know this is an anathema to the maxamilists. But mass adoption requires ease of use. And the fear of losing crypto keys and losing thousands of dollars worth of crypto will drive people to custodial services.

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I have to agree. Onboarding a friend took a long time before he could understand anything and he ultimately thought most things were too complicated for him. So applications are definitely the key to onboarding users and they need to make it an easy process to get things done.

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Who possibly doesn't like things being easy,many times I still mention I'm finding my way.
If not for the fact I have nowhere else to go or I decide not searching for any other options, I'd be the same person as the few person's I've brought onboard.

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an eye opener article first of! Secondly, Rome wasn’t built in a day , Hive will always be a platform based on continuous updates . In all honesty, a novice to hive most times will find it difficult to understand what the 4 different log in keys are used for and when to use them . I feel those are the development sector of this platform should endeavor to find a way to encapsulate all these keys into one entity for a user friendly experience. As regards rules and regulations, I feel different communities on here state that when welcoming newbies so I feel anyone observant will access that info . Security of keys is highly important on here. Without keys , no life on here it’s as simple as that .In as much as I want to earn I know that will be impossible if my keys aren’t secured, so I do keep them safe .

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The post was so interesting because I learnt a lot from it. People want something that easy for them.

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MFW When people you've never met come to your neighborhood doxxing your family and your government has unbanked you and made you persona non grata.

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Hive is always complicated at first but when you get to know it, you will realize how addictive it can be

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One thing about people is, many don't like being patient. They want to make money quick that's while many people account are being hacked today.

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Security first, preach.

Someone creates a Hive account.
That account is worth $0.
But we expect them to spend hours figuring it all out?
On the off-chance they might get rewarded later?
Maybe?
That's dumb.

Very true. That's where having fun comes into play, and why we need more projects like Splinterlands. Just like it's much easier and more fun to do intensive cardio workouts if you combine that with chasing a football.

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In theory, theory and practice are the same; but in practice, they're not.

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NO,NO,NO.been reading the comments and the majority got it all wrong. HIVE and LEO are not facebook or twitter. HIVE is a financial institution, lots of times I don´t undestand a word they tell me at the bank, HIVE is easier than a bank. People you are forgetting that the crypto world is very complicated and HIVE is one of the easisest blockchains to use, we have names we easily recognize instead of long numbers and letters. Don´t get me started with the other chains, are you telling me that ETH is easier to use than HIVE, come on!!! Don´t worry people we just getting started At the beginning of a new technology everything is hard,don´t you remember the beginnings of the dial up internet???

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